Does U2 still take a stand?

Browsing for the latest U2 news and mentions, we came across this article; a concert review of a Crosby Stills Nash & Young gig at the Verizon Amphitheatre in Irvine. The article deeply goes into the political stand the band is taking throughout the concert and generally seems very commendable. One particular quote in the article stands out though:

“It is rather bizarre that considering the state of the planet right now, there is very little protest in music. Unlike the 60s and 70s, only a handful of artists have the guts to speak up. U2 won’t do it anymore, it would interfere with Bono’s political standing. The Stones sort of whisper it, but you can’t shout too loud with a ‘Sir’ in the band.”

This got us thinking and wondering whether there might be some truth in it or maybe the author is just making a hollow statement.

So we ask you the same question: “Does U2 still have the balls to take a stand?”

64 thoughts on “Does U2 still take a stand?

  1. I got thinking about this. This author argues that U2 (and others) don’t really dare to make a stand anymore, where others hail in Bono as the next Messiah, applauding his work as Battler of the Hunger, Bringer of Peace and All Things Noble or Fighter of World Hunger.

    There’s no argueing there. Bono has done a lot for charity and raising awareness, not only with us “little people” but also with the political powers that be.

    To me it seems there is some truth in it though, if you look at it from a different angle. We would all like to see world poverty, AIDS and wars out of this world, so making statements about such things is moderately “safe”. Writing a song such as Sunday Bloody Sunday, The Unforgettable Fire, Bullet the Blue Sky or more recently Miss Sarajevo, which target a far more specific issue is a little more dangerous though, especially in the circles Bono moves these days.

    A thing I have noticed is that Bono seems to often shift the songs into a new direction, where they take on a different meaning altogether. Associating Sunday Bloody Sunday (NO MORE!) with terrorism threat for example, or with the ongoing war in Iraq.

    Possibly, it is just me, and I’m simply not as leftish minded as I used to be.

    Going over all this in this post, I seem to have come to the conclusion that the author of the Crosby Stills Nash & Young article is slightly out of his mind.

  2. I got thinking about this. This author argues that U2 (and others) don’t really dare to make a stand anymore, where others hail in Bono as the next Messiah, applauding his work as Battler of the Hunger, Bringer of Peace and All Things Noble or Fighter of World Hunger.

    There’s no argueing there. Bono has done a lot for charity and raising awareness, not only with us “little people” but also with the political powers that be.

    To me it seems there is some truth in it though, if you look at it from a different angle. We would all like to see world poverty, AIDS and wars out of this world, so making statements about such things is moderately “safe”. Writing a song such as Sunday Bloody Sunday, The Unforgettable Fire, Bullet the Blue Sky or more recently Miss Sarajevo, which target a far more specific issue is a little more dangerous though, especially in the circles Bono moves these days.

    A thing I have noticed is that Bono seems to often shift the songs into a new direction, where they take on a different meaning altogether. Associating Sunday Bloody Sunday (NO MORE!) with terrorism threat for example, or with the ongoing war in Iraq.

    Possibly, it is just me, and I’m simply not as leftish minded as I used to be.

    Going over all this in this post, I seem to have come to the conclusion that the author of the Crosby Stills Nash & Young article is slightly out of his mind.

  3. U2 not political? Is the Pope not a Catholic. Listen to love and peace or else, listen to Crumbs from your table, listen to Sunday Bloody Sunday, lsiten to whrer the streets have no name, to bullet the blue sky. All of these songs have a political or religious protest in it somewhrer in the context of the Vertigo tour. I think the author hasnt been to a U2 gig recently to here the band.

    JB

  4. U2 not political? Is the Pope not a Catholic. Listen to love and peace or else, listen to Crumbs from your table, listen to Sunday Bloody Sunday, lsiten to whrer the streets have no name, to bullet the blue sky. All of these songs have a political or religious protest in it somewhrer in the context of the Vertigo tour. I think the author hasnt been to a U2 gig recently to here the band.

    JB

  5. I am going to make it short, otherwise this would become a very! long post haha ;).

    I think what we should never forget is, that first and foremost the four men in U2 are artists. thus, they do not have the obligation to argue their political beliefs on a rational basis. if you know what I mean. should mean, sometimes their views might be emblematic or naive or whatever. they are dreamers, believers, visionaries, anyway. that’s what makes them artists and keeps their creative spark alight.

    they are also very grounded though, they know everyday life(more or less eh…) and with this they know were their argumentation is going, whom it reaches and what it influences to which degree. I think they are very conscious of that.

    thus, I think their efforts are remarkable. making local versus global engagements an argument when it comes to humanitarian efforts is politics of those who have an easy hand on discrediting efforts like bono’s. I belive it’s hilarious. playing local vs. global, both is equally important. both sets of questions matter for people.

    do U2 still take a stand? hell yeah. they never stopped.

  6. I am going to make it short, otherwise this would become a very! long post haha ;).

    I think what we should never forget is, that first and foremost the four men in U2 are artists. thus, they do not have the obligation to argue their political beliefs on a rational basis. if you know what I mean. should mean, sometimes their views might be emblematic or naive or whatever. they are dreamers, believers, visionaries, anyway. that’s what makes them artists and keeps their creative spark alight.

    they are also very grounded though, they know everyday life(more or less eh…) and with this they know were their argumentation is going, whom it reaches and what it influences to which degree. I think they are very conscious of that.

    thus, I think their efforts are remarkable. making local versus global engagements an argument when it comes to humanitarian efforts is politics of those who have an easy hand on discrediting efforts like bono’s. I belive it’s hilarious. playing local vs. global, both is equally important. both sets of questions matter for people.

    do U2 still take a stand? hell yeah. they never stopped.

  7. @bernhard
    > I think what we should never forget is, that first and foremost the four men in U2 are artists. thus, they do not have the obligation to argue their political beliefs on a rational basis.

    Agreed, for as far artists are concerned… Does the same go for politicians? And then the next question is… Is Bono still solely an artist, or also part time politician?

    Is it possible to combine the two?

  8. @bernhard
    > I think what we should never forget is, that first and foremost the four men in U2 are artists. thus, they do not have the obligation to argue their political beliefs on a rational basis.

    Agreed, for as far artists are concerned… Does the same go for politicians? And then the next question is… Is Bono still solely an artist, or also part time politician?

    Is it possible to combine the two?

  9. Is Bono or U2 taking a stand? No. I don’t see Bono as “standing” on any of the issues he feels passionately about.

    Bono does more than rant about the ills of the world. He goes out and makes a positive change. Anyone can rant. Ranting is easy to do but leaves little impact. It only enboldens the opinions of those who already agree with you. It’s much harder to make lasting change. That takes time and sacrifice. It sometimes means making friends of politicians that you may disagree with on various issues in order to get things done. It means taking time that you would otherwise spend on your career or your family to make sure the ball gets rolling and stays rolling on important issues. Bono does more than take a stand, he gets things done and makes a difference in the world.

  10. Is Bono or U2 taking a stand? No. I don’t see Bono as “standing” on any of the issues he feels passionately about.

    Bono does more than rant about the ills of the world. He goes out and makes a positive change. Anyone can rant. Ranting is easy to do but leaves little impact. It only enboldens the opinions of those who already agree with you. It’s much harder to make lasting change. That takes time and sacrifice. It sometimes means making friends of politicians that you may disagree with on various issues in order to get things done. It means taking time that you would otherwise spend on your career or your family to make sure the ball gets rolling and stays rolling on important issues. Bono does more than take a stand, he gets things done and makes a difference in the world.

  11. Yea, they’ve still got the balls, but maybe under one too many layers of clothing.

    Do some people really hail Bono as “the next Messiah”? Ugh.

    As for the artist tag, that’s all very well if all you want are versions of Zooropa.

    The first (3) CSN songs that come to mind are “Love the One Your With”, “Teach you Children Well” and “Stardust(Woodstock)”- written by Joni Mitchell. The report is from the current tour with Neil Young- the real source of the author’s point.

    I think it’s clear where the U2s stand with what’s going on- I think it’s a bit silly to do a CSNY vs. U2 comparison, since both are simply on different pages of the same book. They’re complemetary more than anything. To me, the Stones at this point only pretend to read (might be age related).

    Singing to the choir is one way to rally, another, less obvious and complicated, and ultimately more effective, is to find similarities within people who would disagree on many things and be able create a new momentum.

    CSNY hits for the gut, U2 is about the gut and the mind- (although it’s still tough to digest “Bad” being dedicated to Rick Santorum.)

    Of course, by going the route of the least common denominator, there’s the danger of coasting, going on auto-pilot and up your own ass. But I do know that the guys are consistent and if nobody in the 5 caught it in time, they have many friends and associates who would not let that happen.

    In the end, actions, not words, are needed. That’s why I vote U2, but I’m no push-over.

  12. Yea, they’ve still got the balls, but maybe under one too many layers of clothing.

    Do some people really hail Bono as “the next Messiah”? Ugh.

    As for the artist tag, that’s all very well if all you want are versions of Zooropa.

    The first (3) CSN songs that come to mind are “Love the One Your With”, “Teach you Children Well” and “Stardust(Woodstock)”- written by Joni Mitchell. The report is from the current tour with Neil Young- the real source of the author’s point.

    I think it’s clear where the U2s stand with what’s going on- I think it’s a bit silly to do a CSNY vs. U2 comparison, since both are simply on different pages of the same book. They’re complemetary more than anything. To me, the Stones at this point only pretend to read (might be age related).

    Singing to the choir is one way to rally, another, less obvious and complicated, and ultimately more effective, is to find similarities within people who would disagree on many things and be able create a new momentum.

    CSNY hits for the gut, U2 is about the gut and the mind- (although it’s still tough to digest “Bad” being dedicated to Rick Santorum.)

    Of course, by going the route of the least common denominator, there’s the danger of coasting, going on auto-pilot and up your own ass. But I do know that the guys are consistent and if nobody in the 5 caught it in time, they have many friends and associates who would not let that happen.

    In the end, actions, not words, are needed. That’s why I vote U2, but I’m no push-over.

  13. hmm, no I don’t think the same goes for politicians, because they have different responsibilities imo.

    yes, bono is still an artist. a rockstar with a conscience, is it ;)?

    he’s also a campaigner, that in itself though does not make him a politician. bono is not in charge. as amber stated, he gives his time for things he beliefs in, when he could surely spend this time differently, e.g. lying on the sunny beaches of eze for the rest of his life.

    not directed at you this one; I honstely wonder how people doubt U2’s seriousness about the issues in question here. they have done it for so long now (more than 20 years). and they have never lost the big picture, despite a few statements that may seem strange to us, because most of us do not confront themselves with the misery of the world on an everyday basis. it’s a thin line most of the time, true, but why not taking the risk. why blaming bono or U2 for taking the risk…

    now, probably I’m being naive or too idealistic whatever. I think the b-man and the rest of the guys are right in what they are arguing and in fact achieving.

    grace, it’s the name for a girl, but also a thought that changed the world. it’s all in this little line.

  14. hmm, no I don’t think the same goes for politicians, because they have different responsibilities imo.

    yes, bono is still an artist. a rockstar with a conscience, is it ;)?

    he’s also a campaigner, that in itself though does not make him a politician. bono is not in charge. as amber stated, he gives his time for things he beliefs in, when he could surely spend this time differently, e.g. lying on the sunny beaches of eze for the rest of his life.

    not directed at you this one; I honstely wonder how people doubt U2’s seriousness about the issues in question here. they have done it for so long now (more than 20 years). and they have never lost the big picture, despite a few statements that may seem strange to us, because most of us do not confront themselves with the misery of the world on an everyday basis. it’s a thin line most of the time, true, but why not taking the risk. why blaming bono or U2 for taking the risk…

    now, probably I’m being naive or too idealistic whatever. I think the b-man and the rest of the guys are right in what they are arguing and in fact achieving.

    grace, it’s the name for a girl, but also a thought that changed the world. it’s all in this little line.

  15. I don’t want to imply that they can’t be wrong at times, just to set that straight 😉

    cheers, b.

  16. I don’t want to imply that they can’t be wrong at times, just to set that straight 😉

    cheers, b.

  17. Wow, you have all made some great points here. At first, I said NO to the question. But, politically Bono is standing up for what he believes. All of what he believes? Surely not. I do think he takes a more cautious approach now. I think U2 has moved from pointing the finger at a single source.

    Do I think it matters? No.

    So, I don’t think there is a simple answer to the question. In some ways they’re doing more than they used to. But, in other ways they are being much more tight lipped about things, especially with respect to their live performances.

  18. Wow, you have all made some great points here. At first, I said NO to the question. But, politically Bono is standing up for what he believes. All of what he believes? Surely not. I do think he takes a more cautious approach now. I think U2 has moved from pointing the finger at a single source.

    Do I think it matters? No.

    So, I don’t think there is a simple answer to the question. In some ways they’re doing more than they used to. But, in other ways they are being much more tight lipped about things, especially with respect to their live performances.

  19. they’re doing better – they’re actually making a difference! it’s a matter of maturity. those who want to stand toe to toe and get loud and in face, good. there are plenty who want those microphones and spotlights and three minutes on the evening news. but exercising grace and diplomacy and peacemaking and encouraging masses to get congresses and parliaments to following thru, not many are up to that committment and lack of posturing. Bono’s become a godfather of sorts to the next generation of influential entertainers, and i admire him for that. so while it’s cool to take a stand, it’s more noble to sit at the conference table of behalf of the africans and bedside of the dying and tell them he and the band will dedicate their lives and sacrifice their posturing so the next generation in africa will live and prosper.

  20. they’re doing better – they’re actually making a difference! it’s a matter of maturity. those who want to stand toe to toe and get loud and in face, good. there are plenty who want those microphones and spotlights and three minutes on the evening news. but exercising grace and diplomacy and peacemaking and encouraging masses to get congresses and parliaments to following thru, not many are up to that committment and lack of posturing. Bono’s become a godfather of sorts to the next generation of influential entertainers, and i admire him for that. so while it’s cool to take a stand, it’s more noble to sit at the conference table of behalf of the africans and bedside of the dying and tell them he and the band will dedicate their lives and sacrifice their posturing so the next generation in africa will live and prosper.

  21. I recently made this post in the @u2.com forum… I thought it kinda applies here…sort of…I could be stretching a bit.

    In the recent issue of Paste Magazine, Thom Yorke has an interesting take on Bono’s work.

    “I think what he [Bono] does for AIDS is amazing,” says Yorke. “no one else seems to have that energy. I think what happened with the Drop the Debt campaign, unfortunately, is that the very people responsible for those debts, the G8–as these things go in high-level politics, if someone chooses to engage with them saying, ‘I want you to help this or change that,’ they want something in return. They don’t give a **** if it’s morally right, they just want the photo op, and that’s where I got off the ride.”

    My comment: Now of course, I know Bono has been quoted as saying he would have lunch with the Devil himself if it meant more $$$ to fight AIDS. I think the band and Bono have had this conversation as well.

    Yorke continues: “After all the talk, they don’t do ****; they get something out of it and you get nothing in return. Not only that but they play the blackmail game where it doesn’t seem to matter that there may be millions of kids outside, Genoa for example, getting the **** kicked out of them by the Italian police behind big steel fences because what matters is the image. When the representatives of the G* get together they seem to forget they were actuallyput in power by the people they’ve chose to ring a fence around and that they’re accountable to these people. They tried to do the bizarre blackmail scheme with me because I’m involved with Friends of the Earth who are trying to get the British Government to reduce carbon emmissions by 50 percent by 2050. They were talking about setting up a meeting with me and Tony Blair. I wasn’t particularly happy or wild about meeting the guy who took us into Iraq, and then they started talking about having a few meeting s beforehand with us just to discuss how the day would go, and to make sure I was ‘onsides,’ so that if perhaps after the meeting I said things less than positive about the situation and what Blair was doing…just to remind me that [kind of behavior] may well jeopardize Friends Of The Earth’s access to the Prime Minister in the future. That’s called ‘blackmail,’ and that’s exactly what they used to do with Bono. And I don’t think that’s good enough, and it’s not Bono’s fault. The constant discussion I’ve had with him about it was, ‘I’ll try to work from the inside, and you try and work from the outside,’ which is good. But what I worry about is that don’t come out of it intact, and it can jeopardize the issue.”

    My comment: I think this is an interesting stance. Obviously, Yorke isn’t comfortable giving the photo op or political shakedown in order to achieve other goals. I guess Yorke is saying the means don’t justify the end and Bono is saying the end justifies the means. Yorke believes you can’t come out of these relationships intact. So do you think Bono has come out of his relationships with political leaders intact?

  22. I recently made this post in the @u2.com forum… I thought it kinda applies here…sort of…I could be stretching a bit.

    In the recent issue of Paste Magazine, Thom Yorke has an interesting take on Bono’s work.

    “I think what he [Bono] does for AIDS is amazing,” says Yorke. “no one else seems to have that energy. I think what happened with the Drop the Debt campaign, unfortunately, is that the very people responsible for those debts, the G8–as these things go in high-level politics, if someone chooses to engage with them saying, ‘I want you to help this or change that,’ they want something in return. They don’t give a **** if it’s morally right, they just want the photo op, and that’s where I got off the ride.”

    My comment: Now of course, I know Bono has been quoted as saying he would have lunch with the Devil himself if it meant more $$$ to fight AIDS. I think the band and Bono have had this conversation as well.

    Yorke continues: “After all the talk, they don’t do ****; they get something out of it and you get nothing in return. Not only that but they play the blackmail game where it doesn’t seem to matter that there may be millions of kids outside, Genoa for example, getting the **** kicked out of them by the Italian police behind big steel fences because what matters is the image. When the representatives of the G* get together they seem to forget they were actuallyput in power by the people they’ve chose to ring a fence around and that they’re accountable to these people. They tried to do the bizarre blackmail scheme with me because I’m involved with Friends of the Earth who are trying to get the British Government to reduce carbon emmissions by 50 percent by 2050. They were talking about setting up a meeting with me and Tony Blair. I wasn’t particularly happy or wild about meeting the guy who took us into Iraq, and then they started talking about having a few meeting s beforehand with us just to discuss how the day would go, and to make sure I was ‘onsides,’ so that if perhaps after the meeting I said things less than positive about the situation and what Blair was doing…just to remind me that [kind of behavior] may well jeopardize Friends Of The Earth’s access to the Prime Minister in the future. That’s called ‘blackmail,’ and that’s exactly what they used to do with Bono. And I don’t think that’s good enough, and it’s not Bono’s fault. The constant discussion I’ve had with him about it was, ‘I’ll try to work from the inside, and you try and work from the outside,’ which is good. But what I worry about is that don’t come out of it intact, and it can jeopardize the issue.”

    My comment: I think this is an interesting stance. Obviously, Yorke isn’t comfortable giving the photo op or political shakedown in order to achieve other goals. I guess Yorke is saying the means don’t justify the end and Bono is saying the end justifies the means. Yorke believes you can’t come out of these relationships intact. So do you think Bono has come out of his relationships with political leaders intact?

  23. Well… the point of “taking a stand” is to “make change”. We all know that Bono definitely makes change (politically speaking). Bono is part of U2.

    So… if:

    Bono = U2
    Bono = Change
    Change = Taking A Stand

    … Then:

    U2 = Taking A Stand.

    Does it not?

  24. Well… the point of “taking a stand” is to “make change”. We all know that Bono definitely makes change (politically speaking). Bono is part of U2.

    So… if:

    Bono = U2
    Bono = Change
    Change = Taking A Stand

    … Then:

    U2 = Taking A Stand.

    Does it not?

  25. I don’t think U2 has to make a stand concerning American issues becuase the are not American. Bono does what he does, Edge did Music Rising. I think they are still involved but at a Worldly level.

  26. I don’t think U2 has to make a stand concerning American issues becuase the are not American. Bono does what he does, Edge did Music Rising. I think they are still involved but at a Worldly level.

  27. I agree with some of the posts here. When did it become required to protest as a musician. Also, I have blogged about this in the past. U2, specifically Bono has entered a new era of protest. No more does it work to have signs with hairy armpits shouting Bush is killing babies!! Bono is putting the money where his mouth is. He is changing Africa’s future. He believes in the true success of a country’s survival which is a stable economy and food on the table and finally getting paid a decent wage to pay for medical care, education etc…
    Music is definately a huge influence in our cultures, but I beleive the world has been saturated with the “phoney” protest artists that think taking a trip to Iraq to sign autographs and take pics is the way to protest ansd “support the troops”. Bull… They would prefer that they were enjoying a REAL Concert in their home country, not under armed guards and a protected shelter.. how do I know, I was a soldier and know about being in the poverty famished countries that are war torn.
    As for U2 and their concerts, I think Bono has been able to balance politics with art. I loved the Love, Peace or Else set up. He does a great job with One. he proves everyone can make a difference by seting up the text messaging for eveyone to donate and “text” your signature on petitions. He has the future well in hand. He understands how to get results and he uses his “Celebrity” status to gain political capital. I see Bono being a major global leader perhaps at the UN in his later years. Think about it. The man is a HUGE musical Celebrity and he balances his time between good causes, music and his family. I tip my hat to the man. Keep it up.

    As for the Stones. I think they are great musicians, but as far as I am concerned. What has the rolling Stones done to help Poverty and other global inititives other then bash Bush before a song starts. Come on. My 9 year old does a better job then that.

  28. I agree with some of the posts here. When did it become required to protest as a musician. Also, I have blogged about this in the past. U2, specifically Bono has entered a new era of protest. No more does it work to have signs with hairy armpits shouting Bush is killing babies!! Bono is putting the money where his mouth is. He is changing Africa’s future. He believes in the true success of a country’s survival which is a stable economy and food on the table and finally getting paid a decent wage to pay for medical care, education etc…
    Music is definately a huge influence in our cultures, but I beleive the world has been saturated with the “phoney” protest artists that think taking a trip to Iraq to sign autographs and take pics is the way to protest ansd “support the troops”. Bull… They would prefer that they were enjoying a REAL Concert in their home country, not under armed guards and a protected shelter.. how do I know, I was a soldier and know about being in the poverty famished countries that are war torn.
    As for U2 and their concerts, I think Bono has been able to balance politics with art. I loved the Love, Peace or Else set up. He does a great job with One. he proves everyone can make a difference by seting up the text messaging for eveyone to donate and “text” your signature on petitions. He has the future well in hand. He understands how to get results and he uses his “Celebrity” status to gain political capital. I see Bono being a major global leader perhaps at the UN in his later years. Think about it. The man is a HUGE musical Celebrity and he balances his time between good causes, music and his family. I tip my hat to the man. Keep it up.

    As for the Stones. I think they are great musicians, but as far as I am concerned. What has the rolling Stones done to help Poverty and other global inititives other then bash Bush before a song starts. Come on. My 9 year old does a better job then that.

  29. Not quite as eloquent as the rest of you but I think it takes a hell of a lot of balls to go into Madison Square Garden and do Bullet in the way it was done on this past tour. Did they change it up because of where they were? No. Bono still got on his knees with the blindfold and his hands ‘tied’. If that isn’t standing up for what you believe in, I don’t know what is.

  30. Not quite as eloquent as the rest of you but I think it takes a hell of a lot of balls to go into Madison Square Garden and do Bullet in the way it was done on this past tour. Did they change it up because of where they were? No. Bono still got on his knees with the blindfold and his hands ‘tied’. If that isn’t standing up for what you believe in, I don’t know what is.

  31. Bono can’t win, can he?

    There were plaudits for the political stance of the band in the mid -eighties but after Rattle and Hum they were “too earnest” or too serious. So they did Achtung Baby and Zoo etc to destroy that image. Then Bono realised he could “spend” his celebrity by getting the ears of politicians.

    Of course, a rock star can’t talk to a president without getting complaints but Bono always lampooned people – see for example:-
    the peace sign while walking on the White House lawn with Bush
    telling Clinton “you can call me Betty” on the radio phone in
    wearing silly African garb while touring with O’Neil
    etc

    At the same time Bono always worked hard so he understood the real issues in depth, so the meetings were not photo-opportunties but a chance to put the hard questions to the people with power.

    Bono ain’t perfect – but what would you or I do in the same position?

  32. Bono can’t win, can he?

    There were plaudits for the political stance of the band in the mid -eighties but after Rattle and Hum they were “too earnest” or too serious. So they did Achtung Baby and Zoo etc to destroy that image. Then Bono realised he could “spend” his celebrity by getting the ears of politicians.

    Of course, a rock star can’t talk to a president without getting complaints but Bono always lampooned people – see for example:-
    the peace sign while walking on the White House lawn with Bush
    telling Clinton “you can call me Betty” on the radio phone in
    wearing silly African garb while touring with O’Neil
    etc

    At the same time Bono always worked hard so he understood the real issues in depth, so the meetings were not photo-opportunties but a chance to put the hard questions to the people with power.

    Bono ain’t perfect – but what would you or I do in the same position?

  33. the reality of it all is that they have took flak for trying to make a differance but the really sad fact is that the powers that be have really let us all down.true life can be cruel unfair etc but music et all does provide us with respite from this sad fact.Me prefers to chill to pop my girls like robbie so there u go

    love hugs to u all

  34. the reality of it all is that they have took flak for trying to make a differance but the really sad fact is that the powers that be have really let us all down.true life can be cruel unfair etc but music et all does provide us with respite from this sad fact.Me prefers to chill to pop my girls like robbie so there u go

    love hugs to u all

  35. i have to agree with e and say that Bono is no longer only an artist. the worst part of his campaigning over the last few years has been watching him biting his tongue all the time.

    i’ve had to accept that i probably won’t see another “fuck the revolution!” out of Bono again, which is sad because his fiery passions are what made me love U2 in the first place. but i think sammi has it right – Bono is still that angry guy, he’s just trying to find a truly workable way to achieve his aims.

    i think artistically, U2 has definitely lost something for me over the last two records which coincide with Bono stepping up his activism.

    when i look at the U2 now, who would never come out and publicly oppose the Iraq war, and the U2 of Zoo TV who parodied George Bush night after night after night, i can’t believe it’s the same band. and in the world we live in now, for so many reasons, i wish is was 1992. those balls are still there somehwere!

  36. i have to agree with e and say that Bono is no longer only an artist. the worst part of his campaigning over the last few years has been watching him biting his tongue all the time.

    i’ve had to accept that i probably won’t see another “fuck the revolution!” out of Bono again, which is sad because his fiery passions are what made me love U2 in the first place. but i think sammi has it right – Bono is still that angry guy, he’s just trying to find a truly workable way to achieve his aims.

    i think artistically, U2 has definitely lost something for me over the last two records which coincide with Bono stepping up his activism.

    when i look at the U2 now, who would never come out and publicly oppose the Iraq war, and the U2 of Zoo TV who parodied George Bush night after night after night, i can’t believe it’s the same band. and in the world we live in now, for so many reasons, i wish is was 1992. those balls are still there somehwere!

  37. For this author and CSN&Y, it’s probably all about the Iraq war. Bono did not come out loud and strong against the war (although he said he was for peace on a pre-war visit with Chirac…”How could you not be for peace?”)
    Bono’s celebrity “currency” would fall if he came out voicing opinions on everything that’s wrong in the world. I think they do this in the music anyway :-), but it’s not as direct and easy as most protest music….you have to look for it. And rather than just “deride the enemy”, Bono looks to make friends of “enemies” like Jesse Helms and finds things in common that can be accomplished. Sure, the Dixie Chicks and Neil Young can say bad things about W., but what does that accomplish? Compare that with what Bono has achieved for his most worthy cause.

  38. For this author and CSN&Y, it’s probably all about the Iraq war. Bono did not come out loud and strong against the war (although he said he was for peace on a pre-war visit with Chirac…”How could you not be for peace?”)
    Bono’s celebrity “currency” would fall if he came out voicing opinions on everything that’s wrong in the world. I think they do this in the music anyway :-), but it’s not as direct and easy as most protest music….you have to look for it. And rather than just “deride the enemy”, Bono looks to make friends of “enemies” like Jesse Helms and finds things in common that can be accomplished. Sure, the Dixie Chicks and Neil Young can say bad things about W., but what does that accomplish? Compare that with what Bono has achieved for his most worthy cause.

  39. I say no. I love u2 but those days are over. U2 will never “dream it up all over” again also.

  40. I say no. I love u2 but those days are over. U2 will never “dream it up all over” again also.

  41. Anyone can get up on stage like the Dixie Chicks or Green Day and scream obscenities at President Bush and Israel … but does it actually solve anything?

    No.

    In the words of Bono, if you need someone to blame, throw a rock in the air and you’ll hit someone guilty. Everyone’s throwing rocks, pointing the finger of blame, but only a rare few are actually addressing the problems and offering solutions.

    Protest smartly, not loudly.

  42. Anyone can get up on stage like the Dixie Chicks or Green Day and scream obscenities at President Bush and Israel … but does it actually solve anything?

    No.

    In the words of Bono, if you need someone to blame, throw a rock in the air and you’ll hit someone guilty. Everyone’s throwing rocks, pointing the finger of blame, but only a rare few are actually addressing the problems and offering solutions.

    Protest smartly, not loudly.

  43. Quick apology for the delay in approving comments and I also wanted to say I’m really enjoying the discussion, and how not a single one of the posts I have seen were a direct attack to anyone else.

    Great to see it’s possible to have an intelligent discussion without attacking eachother 🙂

    Back to you guys 😉

  44. Quick apology for the delay in approving comments and I also wanted to say I’m really enjoying the discussion, and how not a single one of the posts I have seen were a direct attack to anyone else.

    Great to see it’s possible to have an intelligent discussion without attacking eachother 🙂

    Back to you guys 😉

  45. “Does U2 still have the balls to take a stand?”

    I say yes!
    lyrics Love and Peace or else:

    Lay down
    Lay down your guns
    All ya daughters of Zion
    All ya Abraham sons

    if this isn’t taking stands…

  46. “Does U2 still have the balls to take a stand?”

    I say yes!
    lyrics Love and Peace or else:

    Lay down
    Lay down your guns
    All ya daughters of Zion
    All ya Abraham sons

    if this isn’t taking stands…

  47. Well, yeah, that’s making a statement alright, but it doesn’t go much deeper than (to name something cheesy) Miss Universe 2006 stating she wishes for world peace and an end to hunger. It’s not very specific and doesn’t the answer “So what are you doing to achieve this?”

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m playign devil’s advocate here. I do think U2 is still making a statement, it’s just more subtle. Perhaps it’s an age thing as well, where you grow up a little and realise kicking at something fiercely achieves less than actually sitting down and explaining why you want to kick against it.

    In these days it seems like Miss Universe’s statement has become a hollow one. After all, we all want world peace, joy and happiness for everyone. Most people, however, seem to want these things, but not be willing to actually do anything to achieve them. Possibly, because the task is so overwhelming and daunting, likely to take up more than just one lifetime.

    I don’t think this is the case where Bono is concerned. His work is making a difference, namely that it is raising awareness all over whether you like it or not.

    There’s no argument in whether Bono devotes himself to what he feels is right. Frankly, the word “devote” doesn’t even cover his dedication. It’s almost frightening to see the amount of time and energy he puts into this.

  48. Well, yeah, that’s making a statement alright, but it doesn’t go much deeper than (to name something cheesy) Miss Universe 2006 stating she wishes for world peace and an end to hunger. It’s not very specific and doesn’t the answer “So what are you doing to achieve this?”

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m playign devil’s advocate here. I do think U2 is still making a statement, it’s just more subtle. Perhaps it’s an age thing as well, where you grow up a little and realise kicking at something fiercely achieves less than actually sitting down and explaining why you want to kick against it.

    In these days it seems like Miss Universe’s statement has become a hollow one. After all, we all want world peace, joy and happiness for everyone. Most people, however, seem to want these things, but not be willing to actually do anything to achieve them. Possibly, because the task is so overwhelming and daunting, likely to take up more than just one lifetime.

    I don’t think this is the case where Bono is concerned. His work is making a difference, namely that it is raising awareness all over whether you like it or not.

    There’s no argument in whether Bono devotes himself to what he feels is right. Frankly, the word “devote” doesn’t even cover his dedication. It’s almost frightening to see the amount of time and energy he puts into this.

  49. I already had a turn, but-

    Listening to the Clash and the other great “protest” bands, can only go so far… in a lot of ways, that kind of full-frontal is just ways of describing the situation and playing with the deepest wounds- it doesn’t really offer hope that change can be made, it offers the sparks to start a fire, and pretty much just wallows if listened to for too long.

    Do you want real, permanent change, or do you want to justify your ideology? Ideally, both, but each needs to be approached differently to materialize.

    That’s why for example, Bob Marley matters so much- there’s a lot of hope for the future in those records. U2’s been going the Bob Marley route since 1983.

    The great thing is, none of it is mutually exclusive- “I’m Bored” sounds great, sounds better next to “Beautiful Day”. “Holiday” (green day-not madonna) strikes a chord, but if that was all there was out there, it would be bleak.

    That said, I really wouldn’t mind something new that packed the same punch as “Sunday Bloody Sunday”- Love and Peace or Else is just short of the tipping point. And the performance of the last 2 songs last time around would get stale fast for those who had seen the show more than 2-3 times. (That’s why I think the song with the most balls last time around was “Electric Co.”)

    Thom Yorke- If you convince someone who is not like you to do something for a greater good, they agree to do it, and down the road they don’t- do you get angry at them, or go back to try and convince them some more?

    Looking forward to the mid-term elections……

  50. I already had a turn, but-

    Listening to the Clash and the other great “protest” bands, can only go so far… in a lot of ways, that kind of full-frontal is just ways of describing the situation and playing with the deepest wounds- it doesn’t really offer hope that change can be made, it offers the sparks to start a fire, and pretty much just wallows if listened to for too long.

    Do you want real, permanent change, or do you want to justify your ideology? Ideally, both, but each needs to be approached differently to materialize.

    That’s why for example, Bob Marley matters so much- there’s a lot of hope for the future in those records. U2’s been going the Bob Marley route since 1983.

    The great thing is, none of it is mutually exclusive- “I’m Bored” sounds great, sounds better next to “Beautiful Day”. “Holiday” (green day-not madonna) strikes a chord, but if that was all there was out there, it would be bleak.

    That said, I really wouldn’t mind something new that packed the same punch as “Sunday Bloody Sunday”- Love and Peace or Else is just short of the tipping point. And the performance of the last 2 songs last time around would get stale fast for those who had seen the show more than 2-3 times. (That’s why I think the song with the most balls last time around was “Electric Co.”)

    Thom Yorke- If you convince someone who is not like you to do something for a greater good, they agree to do it, and down the road they don’t- do you get angry at them, or go back to try and convince them some more?

    Looking forward to the mid-term elections……

  51. The difference between U2 80s and U2 2000s is that they are actually getting somewhere with their efforts now.

    The author seems to only like reckless behavior.

  52. The difference between U2 80s and U2 2000s is that they are actually getting somewhere with their efforts now.

    The author seems to only like reckless behavior.

  53. hemm, why is everybody so concerned about representations here? why not simply look at the facts. why does a person’s income and her(his credibilty always get mixed up in one sentence?

    why are the U2 of the early nineties not the U2 of 2006. because they are a good 15 years older than back then…it’s very simple.

    concerning the “fuck the revolution” bit, bono and U2 have had the fallout of this statement, most of us will know how, and where it came from. balance “ftr” with “we thank the brave men for making a brave joice” on the slane dvd. this will get you closer to were you find bono’s and U2’s position.

  54. hemm, why is everybody so concerned about representations here? why not simply look at the facts. why does a person’s income and her(his credibilty always get mixed up in one sentence?

    why are the U2 of the early nineties not the U2 of 2006. because they are a good 15 years older than back then…it’s very simple.

    concerning the “fuck the revolution” bit, bono and U2 have had the fallout of this statement, most of us will know how, and where it came from. balance “ftr” with “we thank the brave men for making a brave joice” on the slane dvd. this will get you closer to were you find bono’s and U2’s position.

  55. “We thank the brave men who made a brave choice” was in reference to the IRA’s decision to disarm. The keyword to this attitude is “grace”. Bono is protesting with grace and dignity. It really does make a world of difference.

    Anyone can scream obscenities at Bush, but it takes a courageous person to actually sit down with Bush, explain the situation, and ask him for help. That is mind-blowing, it’s incredible, I’m in awe of Bono for doing that.

    I’m reminded of a quote by Bono – he’s sick of the Left, he’s sick of the Right, even the liberals in the middle are a pain in the arse. There was a Vertigo concert where Bono had a political representative of the Left and the Right present – he thanked both of them for their help on debt and AIDS relief. Name me a protestor who would ask a Right-Winger for help … and then THANK them when they came through with the goods.

  56. “We thank the brave men who made a brave choice” was in reference to the IRA’s decision to disarm. The keyword to this attitude is “grace”. Bono is protesting with grace and dignity. It really does make a world of difference.

    Anyone can scream obscenities at Bush, but it takes a courageous person to actually sit down with Bush, explain the situation, and ask him for help. That is mind-blowing, it’s incredible, I’m in awe of Bono for doing that.

    I’m reminded of a quote by Bono – he’s sick of the Left, he’s sick of the Right, even the liberals in the middle are a pain in the arse. There was a Vertigo concert where Bono had a political representative of the Left and the Right present – he thanked both of them for their help on debt and AIDS relief. Name me a protestor who would ask a Right-Winger for help … and then THANK them when they came through with the goods.

  57. RMG-

    I think you’re right, but the question is: Is it Rock’n’Roll?

    There’s a rebellion in that kind of thinking because it’s new and arguably works better…. but it’s not a seksy rebellion and the challenge is- how to make a “primary colors” Rock’n’Roll song out of it. How to translate something that requires thought into something that was built around the primal instinct….

    It’s not easy…

  58. RMG-

    I think you’re right, but the question is: Is it Rock’n’Roll?

    There’s a rebellion in that kind of thinking because it’s new and arguably works better…. but it’s not a seksy rebellion and the challenge is- how to make a “primary colors” Rock’n’Roll song out of it. How to translate something that requires thought into something that was built around the primal instinct….

    It’s not easy…

  59. ;))

    RMG, I did not argue against anybody here with my remark. I know very well about the background of that statement. actually it underlines what I tried to imply above.

    and I totally agree with you. on all the points you brought up.

    cheers, b.

  60. ;))

    RMG, I did not argue against anybody here with my remark. I know very well about the background of that statement. actually it underlines what I tried to imply above.

    and I totally agree with you. on all the points you brought up.

    cheers, b.

  61. Ack, sorry Bernhard, I didn’t mean it in an argumentative or corrective way! Sorry if my post across that way. I was just quoting you so I could reference Bono’s idea of grace, thanking people for their efforts rather than yelling at them for not doing enough. I agree totally with what you’re saying. Dream out loud.

  62. Ack, sorry Bernhard, I didn’t mean it in an argumentative or corrective way! Sorry if my post across that way. I was just quoting you so I could reference Bono’s idea of grace, thanking people for their efforts rather than yelling at them for not doing enough. I agree totally with what you’re saying. Dream out loud.

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